Setting up (elegant) guides in CATIA or 3DVIA Composer

3D Design Volume Model
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Hello

By making kinematic diagrams parameterized in 3D, I would like to add landmarks. at the level of my solids.

In CATIA, you can set benchmarks. These markers are very useful for positioning shares, for example. On the other hand, in terms of shape (aesthetics), these markers are not very good for illustrations: for example, they do not have arrows at their ends and we cannot (to my knowledge) control their dimension and shape too much (dotted or continuous line).

I would like to make "pretty" landmarks that are also easy to set up.

Do you have any ideas for making coordinate systems for illustration purposes with CATIA or 3DVia Composer?

Using 3DVIA composer may be an interesting avenue because the software is intended to improve the rendering of a CAD.

Thank you for your help.

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To be in plain sight in Catia's arms, you have to put a nice tuxedo on them => ok I go out and leave room to the experts

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Hello

Do you know the optimized copies (under Catia)?

It's for the easy side to set up.

Before you have to build the configurable geometry of your coordinate system in a CATPart.

Under Composer there are guides and shapes that can be used.

What version of CATIA do you have?

 

"EDIT"

Here's what it can look like under CATIA

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Super. Thank you Franck for your answer.

Sorry for the delay in my return, I've been a little sick the last few days.

Your proposals are very interesting.

1) For the one with the optimized copies.

Yes, I know about optimized copies. I think you are the one who taught me how to use it in a previous post and I thank you for that. This solution has the advantage of being really modifiable at will. On the other hand, the disadvantage is that we mix functional elements (the CAD of the system to be modelled) with elements only for the form (the coordinate systems).

By the way, I'm interested in the configurable "landmark" part you did. Would it be possible for you to communicate it to me? (via private message)

2) Compared to Composer, the advantage is that the form and content are well separated. On the other hand, I'm not sure that the guides are editable in Composer. I have to test.

Thank you for your very constructive advice.

 

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Hello.

1) In assembly you can create a "component"  that works like a CATProduct, but does not create a file, and instantiate the CATPart marker. This way you separate the dressing from the system. (put the component in NoShow and exclude it from the BOM).

I attached the file (It's in V5-6 R2014).

2) under compose it's modifiable dimensions, positions, orientations.


x-y-z-axes.catpart
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Video 1 Construction of the Coordinate System Structure


repere-3d.mp4
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Video 2 Construction of an Axis of Revolution and the Original Sphere


repere-3d-2.mp4
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Video 3 END of construction


repere-3d-3.mp4
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Video 4 Optimized Copies


repere-3d-4-copies-optimises.mp4
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Small question about video 3.

For the sketch of the arrow, I assume that you used the wireframes that you created for the axes and that you called X-3D, Y-3D and Z-3D. This then allows the dimensions of the 3D to be controlled by the skeleton.

On the other hand, can you explain to me how you relied on these X-3D, Y-3D and Z-3D axes (in this case the X-3D axis) to create your sketch?

Thank you in advance for your help.

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As the sketch support is referenced on the on-board coordinate system, I constrain the geometry of the sketch on the H and V axes.

In order for the copy to be configurable  "Axis length"

In the sketch, I use two external refs (the end of the constructed axis X-3D and the projection of the sphere for D sphere = D arrow. (it's one solution, there are others, go through formulas etc). 

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Super. Thank you for your explanations. The construction of your sketch is now much clearer for me.

Regarding the use of my reference point, I still have a few questions. I would now like to use it in assemblies using optimized copies, as we have already seen in this post.

Questions:

1) In video 4, for the optimized copy called 3D-Isolated-Reference, if we look at the "component inputs" (as in the Ball part cf post on optimized copies), we find the following elements:

There are a lot of "component inputs". On the other hand, the last 3 entries: X-axis\Vertex.1, X-axis, Rotation axis (if I'm not mistaken) were built from the 3D coordinate system (I mean the 3D coordinate system axis). So can't I delete them? I would then only get the first 3 inputs but that should be enough to have a positioning only of my part body. What do you think?
 

2) Still in video 4, compared to the optimized copy where we took a single point ((called 3D-Reference-on-point), I have a hard time understanding.

In fact, I understand quite well the optimized copy called 3D-Reference-on+2directions. With this copy, we can position the optimized copy (the part body that represents the coordinate system) in a unique way. 

On the other hand, with the optimized copy where we have taken a single point (called 3D-on point mark), if I understood correctly, we position the origin of the 3D marker. On the other hand, the 3D coordinate system will still have 3 degrees of freedom in rotation. It will then be necessary to add constraints to the coordinate system to constrain it to its position in the target part.

Can you confirm this point?

Thank you in advance for your help

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Optimized copies are not usable in a CATProdut only in one part.

It will therefore be necessary, according to your needs, to create a part that will contain all the reference points or several reference parts.

1) yes because in your file you didn't include the coordinate system in the copy if you include the coordinate system the "parents" used for the embedded functions will no longer be selected as reconstruction references, it will be the one of the coordinate system that will appear in the window

Nothing if it is isolated

a point if it is defined only on a point

A point two direction if it is defined on a point and two of these axes are defined on two directions (two lines).

This is the answer to your last question depending on how you want to instantiate the copy you choose how you reference the reference

 

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Super!

I finally understood (at least I think) how the reference elements are defined in optimized copies, even if there must still be some subtleties.

Otherwise, I would like a few more clarifications:

1) for adding the guides in my assemblies.

I would like to set up the method you advised me to separate the system dressing from my assembly, namely:

"In assembly you can create a "component"  that works like a CATProduct, but don't create a file, and instantiate the CATPart marker. This way you separate the dressing from the system. (put the component in NoShow and exclude it from the BOM)."

On the other hand, in what you told me, there are terms that I don't understand:
1) What does it mean that the component does not create a file (in bold in the elements cited)?
2) How do you exclude an item from the nomenclature?

Would it be great if you could make me a little video on this method?

1) Optimized copy of the Isolated coordinate system --> There are therefore no "parent" reference elements of the part body that we want to paste. The position and orientation of the glued part body will therefore be those of the part body in the original part with respect to the absolute coordinate system.

Optimized copy of the coordinate system defined by a point --> There is only one reference point. So the position of the part body will be fixed by this point. The orientation will be that of the part body in the original part in relation to the absolute coordinate system

Can you confirm my understanding of these 2 cases?

Thank you for your help.

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If you look closely at the icon of a Catproduct, it's a double gear on a sheet of paper.

The one of the "Component" is the same double gear without sheets. there is no file saved by this component (it's a Catpart file container and or Catproduct) with the same behavior as a Catproduct.

Exclude from the nomenclature I would take screenshots on Monday (not access to Catia at home).

 

1) Yes and if you want to move it you use the compass.

2) Yes, it is the orientation of the coordinate system in relation to the absolute coordinate system as created in the Source part of the optimized copy. If the position of the point changes in 3D space, the coordinate system will follow

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Thank you for your clarifications.

On the other hand, compared to this point "The one of the "Component" is the same double gear without a sheet. there is no file saved by this component (it's a Catpart file container and or Catproduct )with the same behavior as a Catproduct.", it would be great indeed if you could give me a little illustration because I still have trouble seeing how this "Component" works.

Thank you for your help.

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Hello.

The operation is the same as the Catproduct, you insert parts, formulas, parameters, etc. The only difference is that since there is no file of this component if you want to reuse it in another assembly, you have to copy / paste and break the dependencies.

The "components" are mainly used, for example, for the grouping of screws.

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OK. I think I'm starting to understand better.

With this component, there are no "files" in my windows explorer associated with the parts that I put in my component (icon ).

Otherwise, I would now like to be able to use it to store my markers. My guides are produced from instantiation on optimized copies Coordinate on point + 2 directions.

Also, in order to achieve this instantiation, I am first obliged to create shares in this "component".

For the moment, I am trying to make the following structure:

Product
-    Part 1
     -     Axle system - Part 1 marker
     -     Part body
-    Part 2
     -     Axle system - Coordinate part 2
    -     Part body

Component
 -   3D marker 1 (part)
 -   3D marker 2 (part)

Questions:
1) In the "component", I think I'm obliged to have as many parts as 3D landmarks that I want to add. Now, for each of the parts that I add, I must specify the coordinate system (axis system to be added). This one doesn't matter because it shouldn't be related to the coordinate systems of my mechanism. From your experience, where would you place the coordinate systems of the 3D coordinate system parts added to the "component"?

2) I am now trying to instantiate in these parts the optimized copy of 3D coordinate system on point and 2 axes. On the other hand, I have a problem finding the final destination references, i.e. in relation to a point and 2 axes of the rotating part coordinate system. Could you guide me so that I can instantiate my 3D landmarks but in parts of this "component"? 

I can instantiate my marks without the use of the "component". Here is a screenshot of the result I would like to have (using the "component"). 

On the other hand, I would now like to be able to instantiate them with the component in order to be able to separate the added 3D markers. This will allow me to quickly obtain my mechanism with or without 3D markers.

P.S: I have attached the file where I am doing my tests of instantiating the markers.

Thank you in advance for your help.


essairepisole.catproduct
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With this component, there are no "files" in my windows explorer associated with the parts that I put in my component  .

 That's not it, in my windows explorer, there is no file associated with the "component" (the parts contained in the component have their parts files. Catpart.

 

1) 

In an assembly we can have

- The marks of all the parts coincide (typical case of "molded" tools).

- Each part has its own coordinate system and is positioned in relation to another part , for example, a screw has its own XY reference point under the Z head rotation axis.

 

For the moment I don't see what you design (robot arm, gimbal?).

What do you want to do with the assembly? Normally we use a skeleton (fixed in the assembly) on which we position the parts.

 I thought your reference points only had a cosmetic role?

 

2) 

The Catproduct is just a link pointer to put in a folder. Zip the Catproduct and all associated files (or even screenshot)

 

 

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For 1) 3D landmarks are only cosmetic indeed. On the other hand, I have to create one part per 3D coordinate system that I want to insert and for each new part that I have to define a coordinate system (be careful here not 3D but axis system). So a priori I can put them all on my absolute starting marker. 

3D cues must be made by instantiating the optimized copy 1 point and 2 directions. This point and the 2 directions will be chosen on the different parts of my mechanism (for example a robot arm). On the other hand, it will only be necessary when I change the initial position of my mechanism. The 3D cues (even if they are only there for dressing) follow the new position of my mechanism.

For 2) I gave you the attachment in copy.

 


essai.zip